|
|
Thread: needing input from all repu suspension guru\'s
|
rotarypwrd
Revvin Up
Posts: 55
|
posted June 04, 2003 11:54 AM |
|
needing input from all repu suspension guru's
hola extended repu family,
(please excuse length of post, really wanna make sure i don't forget anything, don't you hate that feeling/experience?)
I'm currently on a mission....a complete suspension mission for the repu and could really use your input, expertise, and experiences.
( calling all repu's rollcall: brad, repuguru, klaus, tom93r1, dpassmore, jeff20b, rotarynews, j-ro, admin, rtrypwr, etc.)
here's the scenario. I've put aside a little $$$ for a rainyday like today to completely redo the old repu suspension/brakes front/rear. My wife will be now using it as her daily driver. so basically I'm looking to get the repu to have a soft (almost cadillac like) ride, but sporty as to be a trackstar occassionally (handle-well), and brake well (lil upgrade suggestions).
I'd like to do these upgrades right the first time, no time or money$$$ for trial n error. what has worked for you all or have you heard that's worked well?
After reading all the posts in this section these are some of the things I have either decided on, choosing between,or thinking about. please help me on these, because I don't wanna have that feeling after everything is done....ah I should've done that too, or "the famous" I should've done/installed that instead.
DECIDED:
-new front coilsprings (coilsprings.com) 100 lbs.stiffer than stock, 1 inch drop.
-Brad's suggestion for monroe sensatrak front shocks.
-New front slotted brake rotors
-Porterfield brake pads/drum shoes (1st gen rx7)
CHOOSING BETWEEN:
-rear shocks : monroe-matic plus shock or tokico blues or
DPassmore's coil over setup?
-new (rear)leaf springs, bushings, u bolts, shaklers
($350 or $600 installed) or just change bushings or DPassmore's coilover setup, does it remove leaf springs completely? dangerous? blocks?
( lowering rear 2 inches?)
-or air/bag susp.? pros/cons, price, soources? only reason considering is if and when decide to tow, don't want back to sag down low while towing and front end up, want more balanced, even truck while driving/towing.
THINKING ABOUT:
-braided steel brake/clutch/oil lines, any sources/prices$?
-beefier front swaybar any suggestions or suppliers?
( urethane or polygraphite bushings?)
???? any other upgrade "while I'm down there" suggestions???
a) I'll need help compiling a list of all! parts needed or recommended for changing/upgrading while I'm doing this project ( wanna make sure all my bases are covered and I don't forget anything after the fact). plus any contact names/#'s for these parts re: inventory in stock and saving $$$.
b) also compiling a list of pros and cons with certain applications.
thank you in advance for all your input and help. I'm planning on installation this weekend, so I need to order everything within the next couple days.
rotarypwrd, tomas
|
|
Klaus43
Rotorhead
Posts: 1259
|
posted June 04, 2003 02:53 PM |
|
Too many possibilities...!
My take on all this is you'll run out of time, or money, before you get it all 'done'... so, to try and 'put Murphy and his darn law in their place':
1.) A REPU will never ride like a Cadillac...NEVER. So, just forget about that extreme. If you were to do all it would take, it's my feeling you'd be spending waaay too much to get there, also at the additional expense of handling and function as a pickup. Just my opinion...
2.) Easiest way to lower the back is blocks. Not best, but easiest.
3.) Striking a reasonable balance between 'ride' and 'handling'--one that is reasonable for YOU--would seem to be where you'd want to start. Achieving this balance will be the challenge... Remember, the 'best' handling (in terms of optimum cornering efficiency) does not alwys result from the absolute least amount of body roll... just for example...
4.) Many seasoned individuals seem to be of the opinion that the 'best' approach to any mods of any vehicle is to begin by restoring it to 'new' stock specs/handling...then assessing the desired improvements, and going from there. They've got a point!
5.) Consider how much is to be gained, per dollar spent, in terms of both ride comfort and handling, if one addresses the inadequacies of the bench seat and it's aging...not to mention the huge differences in feel that come with various specific tire /wheel choices!
Hope all these opinions help a bit... regardless, have fun with it! And, stay safe while working with springs...
|
|
rotarypwrd
Revvin Up
Posts: 55
|
|
posted June 04, 2003 03:01 PM |
|
thanks klaus. much appreciated.
any other repu suspension guru's wanna chime in and put in their $ 0.02. it's appreciated.
rotarypwrd, tomas
|
|
brad
Rotorhead
Posts: 1672
|
posted June 05, 2003 12:59 PM |
|
it's always a compromise
between ride quality and cornering power. cannot have both unfortunately.
to ride comfortably will require new factory bushings everywhere to replace the 25 year old hard worn ones in the green machine. stiffer front springs will compromise ride quality period. sensatracs are a great comfortable ride that stiffen up after approx. an inch of compression, making them a great shock. keep in mind, if you use sensa tracs then lower the truck you'll be in the stiffened up zone of the shock all the time and it will be bouncy! therefore buy a shorter shock. The monroe dimension guide is here:
http://www.monroe.com/pdf/ShockAbsorberDimensionCharts.pdf
an easy way to lower the truck's center of gravity and increase cornering speeds is to just lower the truck. 1" in front and 2" in rear sounds like a good start for the wife. I'd cut the factory front springs and use ghetto blocks in the back. new U-bolts. don't need new shackles. the 77 springs are stiffer than 74-76 springs so you might want to find and cut earlier springs.
get a 1 1/8" front sway bar and urethane bushings. These guys are supposed to make one for REPU. http://www.quickor.com/ Otherwise have them or another shop make one for you. bigger bars and urethane bushings reduce sway and increase in stiffness is very minimal, almost un-noticeable.
the porterfield pads/shoes and slotted rotors are a very good idea and i will be going that route some day too!
monroe-matic rear shocks, they're soft and wife shouldn't complain about them. coil-overs would be real nice but overkill for picking up antiques on the weekend. coil-overs *would* replace factory leaf springs. as for towing, a very good source has towed a 3300lb stock car, a Rx3 race car and a 2-horse horse trailer with one fat horse in it and he said the rear of REPU only dipped 1/2" that's very good. Otherwise airlift.com makes a nice air bag system for ford courier and REPU that works real well. I think jcwhitney.com sells it too. they do sell helper springs to reduce rear sag when loaded, but those also increase rear spring rates and the rear of the truck is already spring firm and doesn't have much weight back there, making rear end twitchy........and progressive helper springs are expen$ive and more work to install.....
rear suspension bushings for the leaf springs are available but use a part number for later trucks. craig posted the part # in the suspension section and I just bought 12 of the bushings and they are real good. size looks right and they slide onto the spindle fine. i'm gonna scan the old and new bushing side by side and post it to that thread. special order, it took 4 days for them to arrive at the dealer.
braided lines another great idea, take all the lines off and go to Earl's on hawthorne blvd right by the 405 fwy and they'll fabricate them for you. don't need to brade the clutch hydrolics but would look snazzy under the hood.
FYI removing the front valance and front turn signals will route lots of air to the front brakes when on the track. ducting would be beneficial too.
like klaus said, it won't ride like a caddy but can ride real nice for a truck.
i might take my REPU to willow springs after summer if you wanna hook up we can do track schools.
i have found it is better to have a dedicated track only car instead of a dual purpose daily driver/track car. too many compromises. why not make the black GSL-SE track only? LOTS of good go-fast parts available for 1st gen.
Later
____________
-brad-
74 REPU Lawn Green
81 Rx-7 racecar. 12a J-
Bridge
|
|
rotarypwrd
Revvin Up
Posts: 55
|
|
posted June 05, 2003 04:36 PM |
|
that's what Im talking about. I really appreciate what you and klaus have shared....now that's input. love it.
anyone else wanna add $0.02, i could use more experience, it helps fine tune my decision making.
biggest questions I'm left with now are re: the rearend.
- shocks kyb gas-a-just vs. gabriel air shocks(pros/cons)
concerns: ride qualty, handling, towing/hauling, longevity
was told gabriel's can come 2 inches shorter toactually ower the rear 2"
- lowering rear 2 inches: blocks
will any of the above hurt the rear or the old stock leaf springs?
brad, also airlift.com is a company for oxygen/ventilator packs for humans. email me back your ph#, want to talk to ya man.
rotarypwrd, tomas
|
|
brad
Rotorhead
Posts: 1672
|
|
posted June 05, 2003 07:30 PM |
Edited By: brad on 5 Jun 2003 20:43
|
my bad....
http://www.truckspring.com/airsprings/airlift/app/mazda.asp
I have confimed on another website that part 59503 fits a Mazda B1600!!! Only buy that after towing once and deciding IF it's necessary.
lower the rear with 2" blocks and buy 2" shorter rear shocks and all will be well. won't hurt the suspension mounting points or rear end. the blocks fit inbetween the axel and leaf springs, effectively pushing the axel up and lowering the truck. buy shorter shocks so it won't bottom out shocks when you hit bumps. because when the truck is lowered, it's suspension travel is shortened and it's using less shock. pushing the piston in the shock DOWN and risking bottoming it out. shorter shocks fix that risk.
KYB stands for Keeps You Bouncing. They are a stiff shock and put too much nitrogen into the shock. But are a great performance for the buck shock. Used to put them in Datsun 510's all the time..... My buddy liked them in his 1998 Toyota Tacoma truck, it DID handle better but was a firm ride.
____________
-brad-
74 REPU Lawn Green
81 Rx-7 racecar. 12a J-
Bridge
|
|
Draggin_2600i
Redlining
Posts: 235
|
|
posted June 09, 2003 09:21 AM |
|
The shocks on DPassmore's truck are QA1 12 way adjustable shocks.. They are pricey but have a good REPUtation.. Airridetechnologies, www.ridetech.com, sell airsprings called shockwaves... it uses the same 12way QA1 shocks but instead of a coilspring it uses an airspring.. They would bolt right up without any custom fabbing.. The rear of the truck would stay stiff since the leafsprings are made for heavy loads, but maybe a fourlink system would help soften it up.. The Downside.. They are about $700 a pair..
I wanna do this to my truck but need to have it runnin first.. The only other thing I wanna know where to get are all the bushings for the suspension..
|
|
Uncle-Jim
Revvin Up
Posts: 64
|
|
posted June 09, 2003 09:51 AM |
|
One other item you should check for sure is the condx of the upper and lower ball joints. I replaced these in my repu, and found it made a significant improvement in steering and stability. I found them at my local parts store. They crossed over to a moog part, and turned out to be the oem parts in the box.
Also be sure to lube the upper and lower A arm joints. This gor rid of squeaks in my suspension.
____________
Uncle Jim
72 Rx-2 Show Car; '77 REPU (250K & goin' strong) 2 - '76 Cosmo's
|
|
Klaus43
Rotorhead
Posts: 1259
|
|
posted June 10, 2003 05:33 PM |
|
Providing an ample supply
of fresh grease to all lube-able points has done wonders for keeping my 'Rat REPU' driver on the road... despite the ravages of time. "Grease is the word, it's the word that you've heard; it can keep things together!"
|
|
|
|
|
